by Tiya Cunningham-Sumter
Normally, I would be reluctant to openly admit one of my guilty pleasures, but for the sake of this conversation I must reveal I am now caught up into all the drama that is reality TV – i.e. Love & Hip Hop.
For those unfamiliar, Love & Hip Hop is a reality show centered on a group of women who are either in love with a hip hop star or want to be one. These women are known to “hold everyone and everything around them down” as stated by one of the stars. The love they have for their men is believable; so much so that one of the young ladies actually proposed to her guy. Not just the simple mention of wanting to get married but the kind where family and friends are gathered, a ring is given and it is more of an event.
What I learned about myself as I viewed this particular episode is that I must be very old school and traditional because I cringed each time she shared with friends her plan to propose. As she picked out his engagement ring, I found myself yelling at the television begging her not to do it. For me, it had always been my fantasy to have the man I love get down on one knee and ask ME to be his wife. And it must have been an assumption of mine that all women had that same fantasy. On the flip side I do have to applaud her boldness; she wants to get married and start a family but after 6 years her man hadn’t proposed yet. So in her mind why should she wait?
I am no pessimist but had I been one of her close friends, after advising against it, I would have to ask how she could be sure whether or not he wanted to get married if he didn’t ask her? I get the idea of taking risks and the desire to be married and being frustrated at the amount of time and energy given to a relationship and still no ring, but there should be an understanding in the beginning of the relationship. A person should determine just how long they plan to be a girlfriend/boyfriend.
Because men view marriage slightly different from women in my opinion, it normally takes a little longer to get them there. Some women aren’t as selective as men when it comes to choosing a spouse; so there’s a reason he hasn’t asked yet. Can you put a timetable on when someone should be ready to get married? Not to say their marriage would be any different based on who proposed. In some cases a man may need that push (being asked) before they decide to make a move. I am just grateful my husband asked me. Had he not, I don’t think I could have ever asked him to marry me. And by the way, on the show the response was “wow, are you sure you want to do that, I’m with you.” Not sure if that was a clear yes or no but I do hope it works out for them.
BMWK, what are your thoughts on women proposing? Are you a woman who proposed?
Tiya Cunningham-Sumter is a Certified Life & Relationship Coach, Founder of Life Editing. Tiya was featured in Ebony Magazine in the October 2008 and November 2010 issues. Tiya recently created and launched (Tuesdays with Tiya) Life Editing Radio show on blogtalkradio.com. She resides in Chicago with her husband and two children.
Lisa says
I think there’s a false logic going on when a woman proposes, as if she believes that if SHE does the asking, her boyfriend will suddenly be interested in marriage. To me, if a woman has to propose, the man simply isn’t interested, because most men, even the most non-traditional, want to propose marriage to a woman they wish to marry.
If this woman has been with a man for six years and he hasn’t proposed marriage, it’s because he doesn’t want to marry her. Yes, I know some folks who’ve been together 10+ years and eventually got married, but those relationships are the exception — plus, if YOU want to marry, you should not settle for a lengthy non-marital relationship.
I certainly had no plans to propose and I made it clear to my then-boyfriend when we started dating that I was not going to be in a relationship for years without a proposal and marriage. Because we both were in our 30s, my timeline was not very long at all.
We were in agreement on this, and he proposed within the timeframe I had in mind… but that was because he was just as interested as I was in marriage.
Tiya says
Lisa, that is so why I didn’t want her to ask him. After six years it’s clear to me he’s not ready and her asking won’t make him any more ready.
Lovebabz says
Yes! I could and have asked someone to marry me. He said no which was the absolutely best answer—we were too young…barely 17-18 years old. We are still friends well over 30 years. Our paths have crossed again and we are contemplating marriage as adults 🙂
Why do men get to be the askers? I think women ought to ask, especially if they are ready. a man can say no just the same as a woman can say no if she is asked. The honor is in the asking…in being asked, not who does the asking based on old fashioned gender rules and roles.
Keepin' It 100 says
I’ve asked out every man that I have ever dated. I know what I want and like, and when I get tired of waiting for someone to make a decision, I move on it. I would ask a man to marry me, no problems, but I didn’t ask my husband. I’m glad I didn’t, because he put a lot of thought into it and made it a very special lifelong memory which I will also remember fondly.
Yana says
I completely agree with you Tiya! Love and Hip Hop is a guilty pleasure of mine too and I am a big fan of Chrissy’s, but I was so hoping that she would change her mind about proposing to Jimmy. From the outisde looking in it does seem like he loves her, but I just don’t hink he is ready for marriage yet. I consider myself to be pretty modern with my views on most things, but a woman proposing to a man is one area that I won’t budge my views on. If a man wants to marry you then I think he should do the asking. Before my husband met me he was in a relationship and his ex proposed to him. He said she set the romantic scene up and everything, had the soft music playing, candles lit, the engagement ring and she even got down on one knee to ask him. He said he broke her down easy because he didn’t want to hurt her, but he later told me that the truth of the matter wasn’t that marriage didn’t occurr to him, it just didn’t occur to him with her, because he knew she wasn’t the. On a side note, I think men owe it to women to not lead them on and keep/get their hopes up if they know they have no intention on being with them long term. Being undecided is one thing, but stalling a person until something better comes along is another.
Tiya says
Yana, exactly I have often heard that men know basically after about a year whether they are with “the one” or not. Women have to be strong too and not allow themselves to be in long term relationships without knowing whether or not a man intends to marry them
Lisa Maria Carroll says
I would not propose. However, more and more, I’m seeing women take the lead and men are accepting.
Eloquence Inc says
Men don’t like hurting women’s feelings and I am SURE they would be terrified of the repercussions if they actually said NO…especially if she goes the crowd route and asks in front of people! Women are generally ready for commitment and marriage before men, THAT is why we wait for men to ask, because when they ask, they are ready, and not before.
That said, while the cold hard facts are obvious to most of us, it is simply HARD to admit that 6 years of your life was WASTED by walking away to start over and hope the next person wants to put a ring on it! It’s sad the state of relationships today. Especially in black America most of these men just do not want to be married, they want to play the field forever and you would think with all the increasingly more deadly and treatment-resistant diseases out there people would read the writing on the wall and commit sooner, not later…but no… and then there’s the fact that not everyone who proposes would make a good husband. I met a guy who when his wife met him she was one of about 4 women he was dating/sleeping with at the same time, and she knew it. He said there was something different about her…but after getting married and having 3 kids for him, his multiple-woman ways have come back out to play…and she has no one to blame for that because it’s not like he wasn’t like that before they got married. Men that are afraid of commitment or just have a problem with committing to YOU aren’t going to magically be better at it because you initiated the commitment instead of them!
Debz says
Your last two sentences are gold. I totally agree!! It’s like with anything. You can’t expect a guy to change. Some women have married men who don’t want kids but they do, thinking that he’ll change because they’re with her, you know. And they end up suffering in their relationship. How stink would it be to be married to someone who refuses to give you kids?? In the same way, if you propose to and marry a guy who was not motivated enough to propose to you first, you could be in a marriage that he is less invested in than you. But if a woman waits for him, she’ll have a way of knowing that he’s certain of her and that she is loved and special to him.
Lisa Maria Carroll says
I would not propose. However, more and more, I’m seeing women take the lead and men are accepting.
A'Teirrah Reid-Hart says
I must say that show is one of my guilty pleasures as well and i felt the same way you did, smh the whole time, screaming you’re a dummy, I can’t believe you are asking the man . I”m an old fashion traditional lady and I must say the only time i get down on one knee is to tie my shoe not to ask a man to marry me. I give her credit she a bold one, I understand that it’s been six years and you’ve been there through it all but it comes a time when you have to make a decision. I can say if I were in her shoes it would be an ultimatum you need to propose and lets start planning or say goodbye to me. Thats just my opinion.
Tiya says
A’Teirrah, I totally agree
Jamalathomas says
me too! no way I could have proposed to my husband. My dad would have skinned me alive because he raised us to stay a woman and allow a man to be a man…. I just couldn’t see myself doing so but to each its own!
A'Teirrah Reid-Hart says
I must say that show is one of my guilty pleasures as well and i felt the same way you did, smh the whole time, screaming you’re a dummy, I can’t believe you are asking the man . I”m an old fashion traditional lady and I must say the only time i get down on one knee is to tie my shoe not to ask a man to marry me. I give her credit she a bold one, I understand that it’s been six years and you’ve been there through it all but it comes a time when you have to make a decision. I can say if I were in her shoes it would be an ultimatum you need to propose and lets start planning or say goodbye to me. Thats just my opinion.
Holliday says
I believe that if a man truly wants to get married to the woman he’s with, he will ask her. And if he doesn’t want to get married… that’s when things get complicated. He could just not ask her and ignore her hints. Or, if she hints or pushes him, he might go along for the ride, but reluctantly. I’m not sure that’s how I want to spend my life – marriage is a hard enough decision for a man to come to than for me to wonder if he secretly regrets it or resents me for pushing him to make a decision he wasn’t ready for. I need to know that this was something he truly wanted to do. If he doesn’t really want to be married, the woman must make a decision to either stay in the relationship and wait, or move on. It’s tough, but for me, I have to know that he wants this as much as I do, and if I propose, I’ll likely never know for sure.
Tiya says
Well said!
Shareef Jackson says
Great post!
” wonder if he secretly regrets it or resents me for pushing him to make a decision he wasn’t ready for. I need to know that this was something he truly wanted to do”
If you replace “he” with “she”, this is the same thing that some of us guys think about when deciding to propose.
Lady Pharanda says
Shareef, I applaud you for sharing that thought. I’m a woman, and would like to be proposed to as well. But it really does go both ways. All women (myself included) are not so “ready” to be married or even want to be married. I believe in the Word, but can’t stand religion or double standards. There are men who may need/benefit from the woman being clear and upfront about her need/want to become one with him.
ultimatum may be needed says
I don’t think most men get married when they don’t want to get married. I think they continue to string the woman along or they make it so that she wants to break up with him. I do think it’s OK for a woman to give a man an ultimatum after having been in the relationship a sufficient period of time. I’ve met 4 men who said that their wives did that and that’s when they popped the question. And they didn’t proposed because they reluctantly went along for the ride. They proposed because they were faced with the realization that they would lose the woman they loved – they could no longer take her for granted. This seems to cross races because I’ve heard it from Black and white men. Like most of us, we don’t appreciate anything until we’re about to lose it.
ultimatum may be needed says
And, if upon stating the ultimatum, he says no to marriage – that’s good news. Now you can get ready to meet the person who is ready to be your husband.
Emma J - Bottom Line says
I agree with Tiya, I am 29 years old, but from the old school frame of thinking. I think that God intended for a man to seek out a woman, and choose her for his wife, not vice versa. I believe there is something about a man really feeling like he is ready to be married, and his actions will show it . A woman has her biological clock ticking, and if the man is not on board, sometimes we can make a mistake by being pushy and wanting things our way. This thinking can lead to a unfulfilling marriage and future. Just my opinion! Check out http://www.drsherryonline.com!
Lasonyashaw says
I strongly believe it is the responsiblity of a man to propose the woman he wants to spend the rest of his life with. Woman have believed for so long, if we have not been proposed to that the man does not love us or see us as marriage material. What I have learned through reading the Word, that God has placed an extradordinary mandate on Men as a Husband and Father. After all, God has chareged the man with a great responsiblity to not only provide and take care of his family, but to love her , like he loves the church. He is to die for his wife, if need be. So, I understand now , why a man exspecially should never enter into marriage likely. Now the question for the sisters is… Do you continue to give your boyfriend wife priviledges? Do you love him enough to wait, if infact he tells you this is the reason? Because given him an ultimatim is definately ill advised! Because at the end of the day, God holds the man accountable, just like he did Adam!
Lasonyashaw says
I strongly believe it is the responsiblity of a man to propose the woman he wants to spend the rest of his life with. Woman have believed for so long, if we have not been proposed to that the man does not love us or see us as marriage material. What I have learned through reading the Word, that God has placed an extradordinary mandate on Men as a Husband and Father. After all, God has chareged the man with a great responsiblity to not only provide and take care of his family, but to love her , like he loves the church. He is to die for his wife, if need be. So, I understand now , why a man exspecially should never enter into marriage likely. Now the question for the sisters is… Do you continue to give your boyfriend wife priviledges? Do you love him enough to wait, if infact he tells you this is the reason? Because given him an ultimatim is definately ill advised! Because at the end of the day, God holds the man accountable, just like he did Adam!
Jamalathomas says
girl you are speaking my language! LOVE IT!!!!
Lapreghiera says
NO.
Chrissy played herself, it was such a sorry scene. What’s more, she had planned to go out stripping and teasing initially, and I thought wow…she has to get his mind sexually stimulated before he could contemplate giving her a affirmative answer on the rest of their life plans??
Not a good idea.
Thankfully she cut the burlesque routine, but it was still sad. What would’ve been awesome was after he said no to her, as she turned away, he got down on one knee and proposed impromptu CAUSE HE LOVED HER, even if he didn’t have a ring prepared…but that didn’t/ain’t happened. Plus I haven’t come across an article where he discusses the proposal, she has been everywhere cleaning up their special, deep, real relationship to viewers.
Too much work for a woman with no ice on her hands if you ask me.
Let the man ask you! Find out early in the relationship what his intentions are. Pay attention to the warning signs/sound advice that comes that your man ain’t the marrying kind, or worse, not the marrying YOU kind. That is always the toughest to handle, he’s been stringing you along 2-4-10 yrs, then HS sweet heart gets divorced, or whomever else becomes available and he is already deciding how many kids they will have.
And don’t try to make your leaving be the ultimatum -that is you leaving, the relationship has expired, run and don’t look back
.
Tiya says
Lapreghiera ,
I did have a sigh of relief that she dropped the burlesque routine too, that just would have been a little too much in front of his friends and family
Eloquence Inc says
Exactly I 200% agree. Especially on the part about men stringing you along as some sort of placeholder and waiting til the girl they really want becomes available. It’s hard for a woman’s ego to swallow not being #1 choice of women, but better pride hurt than some of the best years of your life down the drain waiting on one man.
And what a bunch of these women who are saying they proposed aren’t telling you is the issues that develop later in a marriage from a man who felt pressured into it, even if he loved her and is generally compatible. Women are the first to live in denial when it comes to the quality of their relationships, especially when they have the ring, and some of them know full well their getting pregnant, or proposing, or otherwise putting the man on the spot is what made him marry them otherwise he would still be out there. Men have no problems taking a woman who is 75% of what they want but offering 100% of herself to his beck and call and seeking his other 25% out there sooner or later. And men who know they are only 50% of what a woman they managed to snag but don’t deserve wants, may try and try in that manage to live up to even 80% of her expectations and eventually fail.
Nobody is going to come on here and tell you the skeletons in the closet about how they came to be married if it doesn’t make them look like a princess. So be wary of people spouting the greatness of their non-traditional route to a traditional institution (marriage)…you might not like the bumps and pitfalls they faced on their way to get to the same destination!
Eloquence Inc says
Exactly I 200% agree. Especially on the part about men stringing you along as some sort of placeholder and waiting til the girl they really want becomes available. It’s hard for a woman’s ego to swallow not being #1 choice of women, but better pride hurt than some of the best years of your life down the drain waiting on one man.
And what a bunch of these women who are saying they proposed aren’t telling you is the issues that develop later in a marriage from a man who felt pressured into it, even if he loved her and is generally compatible. Women are the first to live in denial when it comes to the quality of their relationships, especially when they have the ring, and some of them know full well their getting pregnant, or proposing, or otherwise putting the man on the spot is what made him marry them otherwise he would still be out there. Men have no problems taking a woman who is 75% of what they want but offering 100% of herself to his beck and call and seeking his other 25% out there sooner or later. And men who know they are only 50% of what a woman they managed to snag but don’t deserve wants, may try and try in that manage to live up to even 80% of her expectations and eventually fail.
Nobody is going to come on here and tell you the skeletons in the closet about how they came to be married if it doesn’t make them look like a princess. So be wary of people spouting the greatness of their non-traditional route to a traditional institution (marriage)…you might not like the bumps and pitfalls they faced on their way to get to the same destination!
Eloquence Inc says
Exactly I 200% agree. Especially on the part about men stringing you along as some sort of placeholder and waiting til the girl they really want becomes available. It’s hard for a woman’s ego to swallow not being #1 choice of women, but better pride hurt than some of the best years of your life down the drain waiting on one man.
And what a bunch of these women who are saying they proposed aren’t telling you is the issues that develop later in a marriage from a man who felt pressured into it, even if he loved her and is generally compatible. Women are the first to live in denial when it comes to the quality of their relationships, especially when they have the ring, and some of them know full well their getting pregnant, or proposing, or otherwise putting the man on the spot is what made him marry them otherwise he would still be out there. Men have no problems taking a woman who is 75% of what they want but offering 100% of herself to his beck and call and seeking his other 25% out there sooner or later. And men who know they are only 50% of what a woman they managed to snag but don’t deserve wants, may try and try in that manage to live up to even 80% of her expectations and eventually fail.
Nobody is going to come on here and tell you the skeletons in the closet about how they came to be married if it doesn’t make them look like a princess. So be wary of people spouting the greatness of their non-traditional route to a traditional institution (marriage)…you might not like the bumps and pitfalls they faced on their way to get to the same destination!
Reggie Williams says
I guess I’m a bit old fashion and believe a brother should ask. The main reason is b/c as been stated in the comments oftentimes a brother knows it ain’t you that he’s trying to marry – because if he was he would have asked. If nothing else that was definitely my story.
But there’s another issue that confuses me as it relates to the question. Most of the folks (women) who commented said a woman shouldn’t ask, and tradition was one of the reasons. But within a relationship (marriage or dating) it appears that women enjoy the luxury of vacillating between a traditional relationship and one that’s contemporary. The moving target makes being in a relationship tough!
http://www.ruleyourwife316.com
Yana says
Wow! Really good point about moving back and forth between traditional and contemporary Reggie. I never looked at it that way but I must admit I am guilty of this…..
Reggie Williams says
Yana, thank you for your transparency.
Tracita Linda says
I mentioned this same situation to a male friend, who says that he agrees that he would like to do the proposing but didnt want to ascribe to gender roles that a man must propose and if he doesn’t he’s any less of a man.
I’ve come to dislike the term ‘wifey’…and think that the hip-hop culture has glorified a woman ‘acting’ like a wife without giving her what she most likely desires, the commitment. No one should ever be comfortable with being wifey for 10 years, just go ahead and marry!
My argument was simply that there’s something to be said about a man who’s not proposing, and it surely ain’t ‘Because he’s waiting for homegirl to do it’
Jaykalkyn says
Let me preface my soapbox speech by saying that I proposed to my husband of 9 years and didn’t think anything of it. People talk about being old fashioned but really aren’t at all. They are quick to quote the Bible but are not living up to it. Okay, old fashioned is the man proposing…truth be told, the man is also supposed to provide for and take care of his family. The wife is supposed to stay home and take of the home. How many of you old fashioned women work? If you do, then you’re not practicing what you preach. how many of you old fashioned and traditional women pay someone to take care of your kids during the day? How many of you old fashioned men allow your wife to stay home while you bring home the bacon? If were going to talk about it, then let’s be about it. Let’s look at the marriage statistics, 50% endng in divorce, it’s not about the proposal at all, it’s about the marriage. There are a ton of women who got that fairytale proposal and wedding nay to be a statistic a few years later. Now I’m not saying that my marriage is perfect or that it will stand the test of time but I do know that regardless of who did the asking, we established at the beginning that this was not for play and at we were both in this for the long haul. That, to me, is the important part. Yes, I proposed, and yes I even got the beautiful engagement ring, but most importantly I got the man that I love and knew I wanted to spend my life with.
Eloquence Inc says
You may have a point and let me begin by saying whether you stand the test of time or not CONGRATULATIONS on 9 years, that doesn’t come easy!
Most men however have not changed with the times, they want the same things and expect the same out of women that they wanted/expected 2,000 years ago. Us women have changed with the times. The men for the MOST part have NOT. So you may have gotten the one in a million exception to that rule…but just like our extra degrees and income and all that stuff these days doesn’t mean a thing to a man as far as the basics he wants in a wife…what he wants can easily be satisfied by a woman from 2,000 years ago as it could be by a woman of today…heck perhaps more easily satisfied by the 2,000 years ago woman!…our changes don’t necessarily mean men are now going to be all on board with getting proposed to.
They already feel that women took the Sex and the City forwardness to heart in a bad way…and many still feel women who chase them are desperate. And many of them use that to their advantage, not to the woman’s advantage. It’s not so much tradition to me as the fact that women are usually ready to commit before men are and that is why we wait to know when they are ready cause it’s generally assumed that by the time we get to the part where the man is ready, the woman has BEEN ready… the psychology of men is why it is like that, I think. If it seems old-fashioned…honestly men’s psyche is pretty old-fashioned. And many of the ones that aren’t are just using 20th/21st century changes to get lazy and get as much as they can from the new empowered women and give as little back as possible. We see it with the men who on the one hand want a woman who knows how to cook, but on the other hand conveniently wants women to go dutch on the dates…lol nothing traditional about that but he gets the most out of that mentality and gives the least back. That’s what I mean. The rest that aren’t like that can be pretty traditional in who they consider wife material…and it’s not everyone they date or even make a girlfriend either.
There are stories in old days of women who got ready to walk out the door and when the man realized he couldn’t live without her, he got on the ball and proposed…but that was here being willing to walk away from the situation, and still him doing the proposing. These days the ultimatum thing doesn’t always work for a woman and can backfire too easily cause there are just too many women willing to take exactly whatever he is dishing at the moment, for him to really feel a strong urge to rise to the challenge.
Lasonyashaw says
You said it in a nutt shell. A male only wants a woman who can cook, clean and have sex with and give little back as possible if he gives anything for that matter! To me thats funny because anyone can be your wife if thats all their looking for. The truth of the matter, they are clueless as to who they are. They didn’t have daddy raise them, if daddy was in the home, all daddy did was look at porn, cheat on mommy, beat on mommy and abuse His kids. Our males are confused about who they are, what they are to be to their wives and kids. They are truly lost! Just like a man will not ask for directions when they are lost, they will not ask or search for the directctions and instructions on how to be a husband and father. Fathers are no being the men God has called them to be to cover their families and the wives are having to play the role of the Man! Men wonder why they have it hard in the workplace, they need to ask themselves are they doing right by their wives. God plainly says in 1Peter a man prayes will be hindered if he mistreats his wife! i hate to say it but these men are running around with facades and their kids in the inside.
Loe says
Women as a whole are too easy these days for ultimatums too really work. You can be a thug with no job and your pants on the ground and if your girl leaves you there will be another one there the next day or week, might take a month but it won’t take too long. Women becoming non traditional free’s up men from their traditional roles .
Loe says
Women as a whole are too easy these days for ultimatums too really work. You can be a thug with no job and your pants on the ground and if your girl leaves you there will be another one there the next day or week, might take a month but it won’t take too long. Women becoming non traditional free’s up men from their traditional roles .
Tiya says
Jaykalkyn, what made you propose, if you don’t mind my asking?
Jaykalkyn says
No, I don’t mind at all. I felt that our 5 years of dating was more than enough time for both of us to know whether or not we wanted to spend our lives together. One day I just went for it, I hadn’t planned it, just did it.
Lasonyashaw says
Let me first congragulate you on your marriage of 9 years! Yes, you are correct with the statistics of the divorce rate.It is apalling. People believe the grass is greener on the other side. Unfortunately it is not. However, marriage is not about having the perfect mate, it is about loving an imperfect person. Loving them with all the baggage of childhood traumas and disappointments, just like God loved us with our imperfect and selfish behaviors and attitudes! As far as the bible, too many people become distracted with whether someone quoting the bible is living it or not! The significance is not them,it is the Word. As far as marriage, God has a “Divine Order”! Not my order, but His Order!It is God first, Husband, Wife and then kids! People will always have their opinions, but it really doesnt matter, because man didn’t make God, God made Man! So His Word is Bond! You have men who have abused the headship of the Family so woman have pretty much sought independence! In Essence it has left The Family vulnerable. Our kids are raising themselves, parents are leaving their kids education up to the school system,not realizing the politics being played regarding our children. What Im saying is we have gotten caught up in what society says is success and have forgotten about the responsiblities He has given Men and Woman! When u don’t follow His Order you have consequences. Just like in the day of Adam and Eve!
Jaykalkyn says
Let me preface my soapbox speech by saying that I proposed to my husband of 9 years and didn’t think anything of it. People talk about being old fashioned but really aren’t at all. They are quick to quote the Bible but are not living up to it. Okay, old fashioned is the man proposing…truth be told, the man is also supposed to provide for and take care of his family. The wife is supposed to stay home and take of the home. How many of you old fashioned women work? If you do, then you’re not practicing what you preach. how many of you old fashioned and traditional women pay someone to take care of your kids during the day? How many of you old fashioned men allow your wife to stay home while you bring home the bacon? If were going to talk about it, then let’s be about it. Let’s look at the marriage statistics, 50% endng in divorce, it’s not about the proposal at all, it’s about the marriage. There are a ton of women who got that fairytale proposal and wedding nay to be a statistic a few years later. Now I’m not saying that my marriage is perfect or that it will stand the test of time but I do know that regardless of who did the asking, we established at the beginning that this was not for play and at we were both in this for the long haul. That, to me, is the important part. Yes, I proposed, and yes I even got the beautiful engagement ring, but most importantly I got the man that I love and knew I wanted to spend my life with.
Eloquence Inc says
Nowhere in the bible does it say a woman must stay home. Women in the Bible ran businesses. Yes a husband is suppose to take care of his wife, but that doesn’t mean it’s a mutually exclusive deal. He’s to take care of her whether she brings in cash herself or not. Women are to stay home with children…the point at which strangers must be appointed to do the parenting job while the parents are away from the child is where I would agree that the bible and nature intended for women to be home after having children, I can’t even recall the Bible saying women are to be home with children but honestly, it is the natural thing to do when you have offspring, be with them until they reach the age of maturity and be training them in all the things they need to survive and thrive in life and be worthy of attracting a mate of their own. In America that is the first 5 years of a child’s life. So if a woman wanted to be living that life and not giving up her professional career completely, she could make sure she has children at the point that she can open up her own business in her field and work from home, or at the point where her seniority in her career allows her to work out with her boss that she can work from home.
Even outside of the bible the stability of the homes in America is in a mess with the wives gone all the time working as much outside the home as the men and coming home the same time as the men just as tired and worn out from the day as the men… but women are actually looked down on these days if they are a housewife…and so many men do not carry their weight as far as traditional responsibilities to a wife, including, for one staying married to her, and for two making her the number 1 priority after God, that is is pretty high risk behaviour to trust in the non-working housewife lifestyle when no young children are involved and when the man being depended on is not a traditional Christian. (And if a man can’t be trusted for a woman to stay home 5 years of the marriage if she can to take care of his children, then they have bigger problems anyway.) Note I do not include folks who have a trusted family member like grandma to watch the kids while they are away in this.
And some traditions work for some and not for others. For most of the world, and most creatures in nature, the men put out the application to become the woman’s mate, and the woman chooses a mate from among the applicants. Why humans want to turn one of the most natural processes in the world upside down when they are already having the worst success rate with all the changes already made to the mating process…it makes no sense to me.
Loe says
In proverbs the virtuous woman is a home centered woman who goes out to sell at times but still home is her first responsibility. The bible tells women to be keepers at home, but this doesn’t rule out women doing something to help out the houshold financially. The fact that women have milk producing breast show that God intended them to be close to their children
Shareef Jackson says
” I would have to ask how she could be sure whether or not he wanted to get married if he didnt ask her”
Doesn’t this apply both ways – I.e. How can a guy be sure a woman wants to marry if she doesn’t ask him?
I know it goes against tradition to say that, and yes I did propose to my wife, but that question definitely went through my head when thinking about if my future wife was really the one.
I’m interesting in the origin of the guy proposing marriage. My guess is it’s origins are much more sexist and women-are-property based then some declaration of true love.
Tiya says
Shareef, it absolutely applies both ways. Whoever proposes will have those questions/doubts, but because women are generally already ready for marriage by the time the man proposes, in most cases, that makes it a little easier in my opinion. And the majority of what we deem traditional is sexist.
Jamalathomas says
So are you saying that the biblical way is sexist and that God created the wife as property. He tht findeth a wife findeth a good thing……
Shareef Jackson says
@e4c37697eb06f178d1336eaf106c363e:disqus I’m not really a biblical person – and I don’t see what that has to do with the conversation.
Lady Pharanda says
I think Shareef is saying that there is no mandate against a woman asking/proposing. Yes, the man that “finds a wife, finds a good thing.” meaning once you know she’s the quality of wife you’re seeking…stop thinking that the grass will be greener on the other side…make her your wife…she’s a good thing…compared to the one’s you did not find to be the quality of wife you’re seeking. See, no rules about who asks whom. Simply put, recognize that you’ve found a good thing and commit to her goodness being a part of you and vice-versa. Love God, not religion.
Tabitha Ramos says
Im old fashioned… there’s no way I would propose marriage to a man, I would let him know that he is the man of my dreams and my ideal mate but getting down on bending knee
Rubygriffin36 says
Women is doing everything else now…so why not they propose…they taking over the courting field,they not giving their men time to date them…so what wrong if they rush ,and propose,from feeling insecure of the relationship they’re in.are for not knowing there’s a cut-out point to anything… set your requirement,and standard of yourself of what you want sometime…asking maybe a good thang right then..but,late on, you might question yourself…Did he marriage me because i ask,or did he marriage me,because he loved me? I’m just saying…Be careful,what you ask for…but, each it on…
Jamalathomas says
The new Dutchess of Cambridge waited 8 yrs for Prince Harry to propose… this with all of Great Britian calling her Waity Katy….. yet she waited, stayed in her place and solidified herself in royalty. I know this is not the same situation but the principal is. You know when a man wants to marry you. he may want you to wait and if he is worth waiting on them wait. But if you are living with him playing wife then more than likely he won’t propose or you will be waiting for a while. But I would in no way advise a woman to propose to a man… it takes away his job of finding a wife …
Eloquence Inc says
Love this Jamal. And every woman’s wedding day is her day to feel like royalty…but maybe we should act a little more royal and a little less like the bidder on the last item for auction on a cloudy day that looks like rain.
whylie2010 says
I am absolutely opposed to women proposing to men. I cringed when Chrissy got down on one knee – basically begging Jim to marry her. It was so pathetic I couldn’t even watch the first time it aired! And, as you pointed out, he didn’t even give her a straight answer.
I do believe people make too many assumptions about long courtships and what that implies about the man’s desire to get married, so that is not the basis for my disapproval of the woman proposing. (Sometimes, believe it or not, it is the woman with misgivings, or other factors involved.) However, as far as Chrissy and Jim are concerned, this clearly was not the case.
If a man wants to marry you, he will ask. Period
I think some people just want what they want when they want it and they try to force other people to fall in line with their plans and that is why some women propose. Sometimes, you just don’t get what you want in life – be it the life partner you really wanted, or children. People need to learn that life just isn’t fair sometimes and stop trying to force things.
Ajadorsey says
I wouldn’t do it but I wouldn’t go so far as to call it wrong. I’m sure there are probably cultures that don’t have the same traditions we do as far as choosing mates etc. so I’m not sure that it comes down to a “natural” things so much as a cultural thing. To each his/her own I guess.
Loe says
Women propposing to men? Pure silliness. I’ve watched 1 or 2 episodes of that show where there’s one girl who wants her rapper boyfriend to marry her. And i think he bought her something to shut her up. The sheer stupidity of women today floors me. They really expect men who are surrounded by willing women to marry them when they get it for free in the first place. If she gives him all the benefits of a husband already why would he marry her? Men and women are not only different below the waist but in the mind also. Proposing to a man makes him look at you in the wrong vein. Only time a woman proposing to a man is acceptable is when the man had already proposed and the woman said no, and then saw the error of her ways.
Loe says
Women propposing to men? Pure silliness. I’ve watched 1 or 2 episodes of that show where there’s one girl who wants her rapper boyfriend to marry her. And i think he bought her something to shut her up. The sheer stupidity of women today floors me. They really expect men who are surrounded by willing women to marry them when they get it for free in the first place. If she gives him all the benefits of a husband already why would he marry her? Men and women are not only different below the waist but in the mind also. Proposing to a man makes him look at you in the wrong vein. Only time a woman proposing to a man is acceptable is when the man had already proposed and the woman said no, and then saw the error of her ways.
Guest says
Love your comment, and it’s true. A lot of women give the man all of herself, setting up house with out the true commitment. What’s that saying “why buy the cow if your already have the milk”? so clique but true. I knew someone who lived together for 10yrs unmarried but once they got married, in 3 months they separated. I think people get comfortable to quick and really don’t realize that who they truly want to be with. Know your self worth and value yourself and body for the right husband and wife, there is much excitement in doing so.u00a0
Loe says
Women propposing to men? Pure silliness. I’ve watched 1 or 2 episodes of that show where there’s one girl who wants her rapper boyfriend to marry her. And i think he bought her something to shut her up. The sheer stupidity of women today floors me. They really expect men who are surrounded by willing women to marry them when they get it for free in the first place. If she gives him all the benefits of a husband already why would he marry her? Men and women are not only different below the waist but in the mind also. Proposing to a man makes him look at you in the wrong vein. Only time a woman proposing to a man is acceptable is when the man had already proposed and the woman said no, and then saw the error of her ways.
Sy_harrris says
I watched that episode with my 51 yr. old husband, (he just happened to be in the room while the show was on) and he took one glimpse at Jim and said, “That dude needs a li’l push in the right direction. She’s doing the right thing.” I was shocked that Jim said, “Yes.” But my man just looked over his shoulder at me and said, “Some guys just need that li’l push to get on the right track.”
Eloquence Inc says
wow I’m shocked. Why are the men in the rest of the world getting it done with no extra push for the most part but the men in America need so much darn BABYING? smh
Lady Pharanda says
Now, that’s the truth! Some ( I said some..some) men do need that push. I’d go so far as to call it encouragement, especially if it’s truly from a heart of great intentions. There’s nothing wrong with a woman who has purposely shown a man support, encouragement, love and understanding…to ask if he’s willing to commit considering all her investments in him. And let’s face it, men don’t just give away their hearts, as do many women. So, maybe she (as well as other women) simply wants to know if/when she should stop investing and prepare for other options, as men do. Don’t forget, cross culturalization. We’re not possessions anymore, we get to choose as well.
Mzcareercoach says
I have to admit that I have watched 2 or 3 episodes of this show. However, after the marriage proposal episode, I just shook my head and stopped watching. It seems that she wanted it so Badly and he just looked indifferent after she proposed. I know everyone shows emotions differently and each and every case is different, but from watching the show it just seemed that Jim Jones was content with the way the relationship was going, so why rock the boat. (I could be wrong, after all this reality tv, whos knows what really goes on behind the scenes). But, she already lives with him, they have built some sort of lifestyle together, so it just seems like there is certainly in NO rush to be officially tied down for HIM!! At the same time, I am traditional and I truly believe if the man wants to marrry you, He WILL propose. Let the man feel like a Man!! If a woman is living with a Man for years and years and years and giving up wifey privileges–taking care of the house and the bedroom and holding everything else down, and complains that she still hasn’t “got a ring on it”, then she needs to re-evaluate her role in the situation as well. I’m just saying!
StillDaddy says
I am not against women proposing. I actually joke with my current girlfriend that we are not getting married until she proposes. I am totally kidding. When the time is right I will propose.
I am however a little troubled by unwillingness of men to commit. I am seeing more and more men shy away from real commitment whether its marriage, leadership roles in the community, fatherhood, etc. hence more women proposing.
Blaq Mind says
Marriage isn’t a proposition it’s a commitment, one in which anyone is allowed to make. Whats the difference in wanting to get married, (practically begging to be) and actually going after it making it happen for yourself. Why are men pressured to make all the big life changing decisions. begging to be) and actually going after it making it happen for yourself. Why are men pressured to make all the big life changing decisions.
BMWK guest says
To me it seems more natural for a man to propose to a women. I know in scripture it states in Proverbs 18:22 “A man who finds a good wife receives Grace from the God the Father.” u00a0So the woman is the blessing to the man. I love that feeling knowing I am and will be special enough for a man to honor me by wanting my hand in marriage. For sure women are Gods greatest blessing to man (in marriage, not joking, its biblical). u00a0When that commitment is made, that man is to Love his wife u00a0and the woman is to respect her man (truth) all things will be good.u00a0nI also love a man that knows what he wants and is not afraid to get it, want it, love it and cherish it(me). Times and trends change but I rather just keep things simple and practical so I don’t go crazy. I look for a man to lead and definitely to lead in asking for my hand in marriage.u00a0
ChildofGod says
The Hebrew mentions that the only way a man can find a wife; through the ultimate source of his soul, give his mental capacity of love to a woman, is if he recognizes in her, the ability to respond to his love. Women are designed by God to be the responders to a manu2019s love. This is so powerful to me, a man who finds a wife finds a good thing Proverbs 18:22. I only know Gods way, trust in His words and ways (wisdom) always. My opinion at the end of the day is my opinion. Sometimes a good idea is not a God idea. Be blessedu00a0
Tanner Campbell says
I personally don’t have a desire to get married. Not that I have anything against the idea, just that I see it as largely unnecessary. If you love someone, a scrap of paper and an expensive ceremony isn’t going to make you love them any more than you already do. Is it?
I also find the arrangement unrealistic. You’re promising a person that you’re going to love them forever, and that’s a fantastic sentiment but the underlying message that is nearly always missed is this: You’re promising someone that you know what you’re going to be like in 10, 20, 30, 40, and 50 years. That you’ll be who you are now, then. That you’ll have the same interests and desires. Moreover you’re promising that your personal growth will always mirror your partners. Don’t get me wrong, I do think that this can actually happen but I don’t think that people can know that it will. It just ends up working out.
More often then not what you end up with is a divorce or a less than wonderful relationship with someone that you struggle to make work – all the time compromising your own personal happiness for the institute of marriage.
Marriage is a fantastic thing when it works, but when it doesn’t work … geeze.
Marriage is a legally binding arrangement, you can’t just leave when you’re unhappy … or at least, you can’t leave easily. For this reason many marriages are miserable … “well it’s bad, but it’s not bad enough to go through a divorce”. So you have these people who aren’t MISERABLE but they aren’t happy either … staying together for the sake of a ecclesiastic and/or personal promise.
I’ll likely marry my girlfriend Brittany. She’s great and I love her more than I can put into words, but getting married is to make her happy, not me. After a grand wedding and spending tens of thousands of dollars on the reception, I’m not going to love her one ounce more than I do right now … but women seem to think otherwise; that a ring and a ceremony changes everything. Maybe to them it does, who knows. They see the commitment in it and think it means something, and it does. It means you’re both being incredibly unrealistic, throwing caution to the wind, and promising each other the world.
Commitment isn’t really worth anything because no one can see into the future, no one knows, it’s a hopeful promise that’s all. Commitment is another way of saying “I promise that no matter how shitty or hard it gets I’ll stick with it and I’ll have faith it’ll get better.” That would be a really honest way of proposing wouldn’t it? “I love you so much (right now) that I promise I’ll stick with you forever no matter how shitty things get.” I mean, am I wrong? Isn’t that faith, and isn’t faith commitment? What kind of promise is that? If you inspect it, what you’re really saying is, “I am willing to (possibly) compromise my personal happiness and well-being to an infinite extent in order to keep us together forever.” Say whaaat?
Why not just date, live together, and be happy until such a time that it requires too much self-compromising to work? And hey if it works out, you spend your whole lives together and happy … in the end isn’t THAT what it’s all about?
Most people call this “a fear of commitment”, I call it logical thought. What do you think?
Michellen Burwell says
I definitely could not ask my boy friend to marry me. Why? Because, him proposing to me would confirm his commitment to our relationship.
Annie Khalid says
Wow im so late at this but I just stumbled upon this article while googling around.
Yes, I have proposed a guy after drooling after him for three years. I always thought that he might be secretly interested in me too as I caught him looking at me a zillion times at work and also he would always be nervous around me which I assumed was probably his shy nature. Anyways, he moved to Dubai and after a few months I emailed him and confessed my feelings towards him. He replied back with a one liner email which was basically a polite ‘sorry I am not interested’. Honestly, I thought it was great that I gathered the urge to talk to him about the way I felt but it hasnt really helped me in moving on with my life. I still think about him even though it has been a good 7 months now from the time I emailed him. I know I would be sounding completely pathetic to a lot of people and every one would ask me to move on and I am trying.
Anyway, no regrets on being upfront with him. At least I got it off my chest and know how he felt about me but I sure do wish I could just stop thinking about him and move on already!! 🙂
Trisha says
I prefer the old fashion way of a man proposing. It’s a beautiful thing!